LISTSERV mailing list manager LISTSERV 16.0

Help for LATEX-L Archives


LATEX-L Archives

LATEX-L Archives


LATEX-L@LISTSERV.UNI-HEIDELBERG.DE


View:

Message:

[

First

|

Previous

|

Next

|

Last

]

By Topic:

[

First

|

Previous

|

Next

|

Last

]

By Author:

[

First

|

Previous

|

Next

|

Last

]

Font:

Proportional Font

LISTSERV Archives

LISTSERV Archives

LATEX-L Home

LATEX-L Home

LATEX-L  October 1997

LATEX-L October 1997

Subject:

Re: LaTeX journal and publisher macros

From:

MERTENS Jean-Francois <[log in to unmask]>

Reply-To:

Mailing list for the LaTeX3 project <[log in to unmask]>

Date:

Tue, 14 Oct 1997 01:04:54 +0100

Content-Type:

text/plain

Parts/Attachments:

Parts/Attachments

text/plain (98 lines)

   Reactions to P. Helbig's suggestion are well summarized in bbeeton's
reply, and in H. Aberg's comments on the name issue.
   I would just like to stress a bit more this last issue, and first to raise
3 other points:

   1) Concerning classification numbers: I tend to give in preprints
classification numbers according to several different schemes _ say AMS and
Journal of Economic Literature, and sometimes in addition IAOR an OR/MS _
while the journal where I finally send it may retain only a subset of it (but
many do print several). I think this rather customary and might become even
more so in any somewhat cross-disciplinary field. Now this can only be done
by visual formatting. Doing better might require some encoding of the more
usual schemes _ since typically every journal wants to typeset the names of
the schemes it uses in a different way.

   2) Concerning address-data:  some journals may feel that the use of
address-data is to enable readers to write to the authors, so the
address-field has to contain all information needed to write a proper
envelope: this means in particular a) the line-breaks (which get lost e.g. in
the output of amsart), b) the address has to be written in the language of
the destination country (with possibly adding in parentheses the translation
of the country-name in the language of the paper), and c) the first line has
to be there too, and cannot be taken simply from the name-field, due to the
widely different habits in different countries on this point, which some
journals may want to respect ( think of the pre-pending of "Herr Professor
Doctor Ing." or other "Excellentissimo"'s).

   3) The proposed grouping of the information is a major pain in the neck
for authors: if all data were grouped by author _ i.e. all data of author 1,
followed by all those of author 2, etc. _, authors would just have to make
once and for all a personal-data file (like latexbug.cfg _ thanks!), and in
each paper one would just have to input those files for the different
co-authors.
   Clearly this will in some cases require more work from the class-file, to
test say whether some affiliations are common between some of the co-authors,
but this seems a price  well worth to pay _ and co-authors from the same
institution can be instructed by a journal to take care to fill in their
common fields identically (or by a common macro).

   4) Concerning names: it are clearly not only Chinese names (or
south-indian, or from other far-away places) that have a completely different
STRUCTURE than the US one.
   Just as to surnames already, I get that in Spain typically an individual's
surname has his wife's maiden-name after his own _ so is no longer a
"family-name" (in the sense of being the same as for his brothers). But the
"given" (or: "preferred") name would typically be just the first part. In
Portugal on the contrary, (part of) the mother's name would be pre-pended to
() the father's name in naming the children _ and the "given" (or:
"preferred") name would be some final part. Even here, a colleague of mine
has "d'Aspremont-Lynden" as surname (so Bibtex misses the "von" part, because
of the absence of a space), but the "given" name would be just "d'Aspremont"
(so even a hyphen doesn't mean the 2 parts have to be treated equally _ the
name could equally plausibly have been "Lynden-d'Aspremont", with "Lynden" as
"given" name.).
    And for complete names, something like "Maria de Dolores de Garcia de la
Vega" would be a quite plausible Spanish name (with similar examples in
several other languages), but with 3 "von" parts, of which it is the SECOND
that separates first and last name... And the textbook example of "de La
Vallee Poussin" signs some of his books with "Charles-J." as first name (so
nothing like Charles Louis ...), while his "given" first name was just
"Charles": so this is a case where a hyphen between the 2 first names does
NOT mean they are a single "given" name and should be treated equally.

    In summary, I think there is no hope to parse complete names correctly,
and one has to ask for the individual name-components.
    Further, it seems to me that for each of those components one has to ask
the full form (if only just for database use: it seems ridiculous to refer in
databases with different names to the same individual, so this probably means
in practice one has to use there the full form, as in the Library of Congress
cards), and the "given"- or "preferred" form (if only for uses like headers)
(reduction to initials can well be handled automatically _ cf. e.g. BibTeX _,
so no need to bother authors with that).
    As to those components, we need concepts that are as widely meaningful as
possible _ to avoid "visual markup" _, and I have no precise idea what those
might be... I heard that Patashnik is working hard on BibTeX 1.00; and he
must have given serious thought to this question. Since in addition there may
be obvious advantages in coordinating this question with BibTeX, one should
probably ask his opinion.


    PS.  It also seems to me it would be quite useful for such a project from
people in other disciplines (most of this mailing-list seems to have more of
a "hard-sciences" background ?), like law, classic philology, etc. They may
have different viewpoints, that might enrich and improve the final product
even for our own purposes.
--

                               Jean-François Mertens.

J.F. Mertens, [ Tel: 32-10-474309, e-mail: [log in to unmask]]
CORE, [ 32-10-474321, Fax: 32-10-474301, [log in to unmask]]
34, Voie du Roman Pays,
B-1348, Louvain-la-Neuve,
Belgium.
Home: Tel. 32-2-6521970
2, Rue de Limalsart,
B-1330, Rixensart,
Belgium.

Top of Message | Previous Page | Permalink

Advanced Options


Options

Log In

Log In

Get Password

Get Password


Search Archives

Search Archives


Subscribe or Unsubscribe

Subscribe or Unsubscribe


Archives

September 2019
July 2019
April 2019
March 2019
February 2019
January 2019
December 2018
November 2018
October 2018
September 2018
August 2018
June 2018
May 2018
April 2018
February 2018
January 2018
December 2017
September 2017
August 2017
July 2017
June 2017
May 2017
April 2017
March 2017
February 2017
January 2017
December 2016
July 2016
April 2016
March 2016
February 2016
January 2016
October 2015
September 2015
August 2015
July 2015
June 2015
May 2015
April 2015
March 2015
February 2015
January 2015
December 2014
November 2014
October 2014
September 2014
August 2014
July 2014
June 2014
May 2014
April 2014
March 2014
February 2014
January 2014
December 2013
November 2013
October 2013
August 2013
July 2013
June 2013
May 2013
April 2013
March 2013
February 2013
January 2013
December 2012
November 2012
September 2012
August 2012
July 2012
June 2012
May 2012
March 2012
February 2012
January 2012
December 2011
November 2011
October 2011
September 2011
August 2011
July 2011
June 2011
May 2011
April 2011
March 2011
February 2011
January 2011
December 2010
November 2010
October 2010
September 2010
August 2010
July 2010
June 2010
May 2010
March 2010
February 2010
January 2010
December 2009
November 2009
October 2009
September 2009
August 2009
July 2009
June 2009
May 2009
April 2009
March 2009
February 2009
January 2009
December 2008
November 2008
October 2008
September 2008
May 2008
April 2008
March 2008
February 2008
January 2008
December 2007
November 2007
September 2007
August 2007
June 2007
May 2007
March 2007
December 2006
November 2006
October 2006
August 2006
July 2006
June 2006
May 2006
April 2006
March 2006
February 2006
November 2005
October 2005
September 2005
August 2005
May 2005
April 2005
March 2005
November 2004
October 2004
August 2004
July 2004
May 2004
April 2004
March 2004
February 2004
January 2004
December 2003
October 2003
August 2003
July 2003
June 2003
May 2003
April 2003
March 2003
February 2003
January 2003
December 2002
October 2002
September 2002
August 2002
July 2002
June 2002
March 2002
December 2001
October 2001
September 2001
August 2001
July 2001
June 2001
May 2001
April 2001
March 2001
February 2001
January 2001
December 2000
November 2000
October 2000
September 2000
August 2000
July 2000
May 2000
April 2000
March 2000
February 2000
January 2000
December 1999
November 1999
October 1999
September 1999
August 1999
May 1999
April 1999
March 1999
February 1999
January 1999
December 1998
November 1998
October 1998
September 1998
August 1998
July 1998
June 1998
May 1998
April 1998
March 1998
February 1998
January 1998
December 1997
November 1997
October 1997
September 1997
August 1997
July 1997
June 1997
May 1997
April 1997
March 1997
February 1997
January 1997
December 1996

ATOM RSS1 RSS2



LISTSERV.UNI-HEIDELBERG.DE

Universität Heidelberg | Impressum | Datenschutzerklärung

CataList Email List Search Powered by the LISTSERV Email List Manager