Hi Frank, > > in my opinion middle floats always float ;-) "Middle" floats could float > > from the column top to the column bottom; if there's room left before or > > after one should apply the standard orphan/widow rules (but if a > > designer wants a fixed middle placement one should have an option like > > the absolute placement for top and bottom position). They can be of > > different size and therefore I don't think there is a algorithm that > > will satisfy all possible combinations automatically. As said there > > should be a possibility for a fixed position on the page, e.g., on top > > or bottom or both (wether in single column mode or more) and maybe even > > in combination with column number, e.g., left column, middle, right (or > > one, two, three, ...) -- In this case I would like to have an option to > > place some text at the original position when the float has been moved. > > I didn't meant to discuss "here" floats as in LaTeX2e which indeed nearly > always float :-) ---and if they do, your idea of allowing some alternate text > to appear is a good one. o.k., just some book designer's thoughts > I was/am after a design that supports one or more float area that is not on > the top/bottom of the page but somewhere within the page, i.e., a place or > more where floats float into, for example in a design where part of the margin > is being used for floats > > ttt ttt > ttt ttt > ttt > AAAAA ttt > AAAAA ttt > AAAAA ttt > ttt > ttt ttt > ttt ttt > ttt ttt but this is already a very special case! Here I would propose to put the vertical float area in a visual pleasing place, like the golden ratio. > the xor implementation has already changed that drastically by supporting > > - spanning float areas across multiple columns (in a multi-column design with > cols >=2), > > - relations betwen float areas, e.g., if a float is place in one area, other > areas may not be allowed to receive floats > > - more flexibility in specifying float callout relation I presupposed this already ;-) > > > Questions: > > > > > > * What kind of other specs can you think of? > > > for fixed positions: > > [col=1, pos=<t,c,b,>, col=2, pos=<t,c,b,>, col=3, pos=<t,c,b,>, ...] or > > even > > [col=1, pos=absolute(10cm), ...], [col=1, pos=absolute(10\baselineskip), > > ...], or [col=1, pos=<Bassline|top|bottom>(10\baselineskip), ...] > > > > If I understand this correctly than those are suggestions more in line of > spcifying layout on a per page basis, e.g. place this float in that position > on this page ... That is a different beast altogether and in fact xor will > have this ability too (though right now it is broken) No, not on a per page basis. More a spec for defining float areas, top and bottom are self-explaining but some absolute measure allows for visually pleasing placement of 'middle' areas (and combined with a 'vsize' option you can get a consistent layout), e.g., tttttttttt tttttttttt tttttttttt tttttttttt tttttttttt tttttttttt tttttttttt tttttttttt tttttttttt tttttttttt tttttttttt tttttttttt tttttttttt tttttttttt tttttttttt tttttttttt tttttttttt tttttttttt tttttttttt tttttttttt tttttttttt tttttttttt tttttttttt tttttttttt tttttttttt tttttttttt tttttttttt +--------+ tttttttttt tttttttttt +--------+ AAAAAAAAAA tttttttttt tttttttttt AAAAAAAAAA AAAAAAAAAA tttttttttt tttttttttt AAAAAAAAAA AAAAAAAAAA tttttttttt tttttttttt AAAAAAAAAA AAAAAAAAAA tttttttttt tttttttttt +--------+ tttttttttt tttttttttt +--------+ tttttttttt tttttttttt tttttttttt tttttttttt tttttttttt tttttttttt tttttttttt tttttttttt tttttttttt tttttttttt tttttttttt tttttttttt tttttttttt tttttttttt tttttttttt tttttttttt tttttttttt tttttttttt tttttttttt tttttttttt tttttttttt tttttttttt tttttttttt tttttttttt tttttttttt tttttttttt tttttttttt tttttttttt tttttttttt tttttttttt tttttttttt tttttttttt tttttttttt tttttttttt tttttttttt tttttttttt tttttttttt tttttttttt tttttttttt tttttttttt tttttttttt tttttttttt tttttttttt tttttttttt tttttttttt tttttttttt 112 113 tttttttttt tttttttttt tttttttttt tttttttttt tttttttttt tttttttttt tttttttttt tttttttttt tttttttttt tttttttttt tttttttttt tttttttttt tttttttttt tttttttttt tttttttttt tttttttttt tttttttttt tttttttttt tttttttttt tttttttttt tttttttttt tttttttttt tttttttttt tttttttttt tttttttttt tttttttttt tttttttttt +--------+ +--------+ tttttttttt +--------+ AAAAAAAAAA AAAAAAAAAA tttttttttt AAAAAAAAAA AAAAAAAAAA AAAAAAAAAA tttttttttt AAAAAAAAAA AAAAAAAAAA AAAAAAAAAA tttttttttt AAAAAAAAAA AAAAAAAAAA tttttttttt +--------+ +--------+ tttttttttt +--------+ tttttttttt tttttttttt tttttttttt tttttttttt tttttttttt tttttttttt tttttttttt tttttttttt tttttttttt tttttttttt tttttttttt tttttttttt tttttttttt tttttttttt tttttttttt tttttttttt tttttttttt tttttttttt tttttttttt tttttttttt tttttttttt tttttttttt tttttttttt tttttttttt tttttttttt tttttttttt tttttttttt tttttttttt tttttttttt tttttttttt tttttttttt tttttttttt tttttttttt tttttttttt tttttttttt tttttttttt tttttttttt tttttttttt tttttttttt tttttttttt tttttttttt tttttttttt tttttttttt tttttttttt tttttttttt tttttttttt 114 115 tttttttttt tttttttttt tttttttttt tttttttttt tttttttttt tttttttttt tttttttttt tttttttttt tttttttttt tttttttttt tttttttttt tttttttttt tttttttttt tttttttttt tttttttttt tttttttttt tttttttttt tttttttttt tttttttttt tttttttttt tttttttttt tttttttttt tttttttttt tttttttttt tttttttttt tttttttttt tttttttttt +--------+ +--------+ +---------------------+ AAAAAAAAAA AAAAAAAAAA AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA AAAAAAAAAA AAAAAAAAAA AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA AAAAAAAAAA AAAAAAAAAA AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA AAAAAAAAAA AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA +--------+ +--------+ +---------------------+ tttttttttt tttttttttt tttttttttt tttttttttt tttttttttt tttttttttt tttttttttt tttttttttt tttttttttt tttttttttt tttttttttt tttttttttt tttttttttt tttttttttt tttttttttt tttttttttt tttttttttt tttttttttt tttttttttt tttttttttt tttttttttt tttttttttt tttttttttt tttttttttt tttttttttt tttttttttt tttttttttt tttttttttt tttttttttt tttttttttt tttttttttt tttttttttt tttttttttt tttttttttt tttttttttt tttttttttt tttttttttt tttttttttt tttttttttt tttttttttt tttttttttt tttttttttt tttttttttt tttttttttt tttttttttt tttttttttt 116 117 etc.pp. > But what I'm after is this: > > - assuming you have the possibility of specifying one (or more?) middle areas > for floats by which I mean an area to receieve float(s) where above and > below there is still text > > - when what kind of algorithmic specifications and rules should govern this > area and how it is filled? float area, position, size, <ordering>, <rulers>, <colour specs, including transparency>, spans, spreads (two page spans), 'margin offset' (ill. goes inside margin) Ulrich