Hi, Am I mistaken or did \msg_four_spaces: once exist? (For when writing messages to the console output.) Writing \c_space_tl \c_space_tl \c_space_tl \c_space_tl just doesn't have the same ring to it. (Happy calling it \msg_indent: or something else if that would be better?) Or am I just crazy? I know we don't just want to add new functions at random all the time. -- Will